State of the Nation

[Francesco]

IMHO, the only way for chronopia and WZ to resurrect in a new, official release, is only one: Paradox must sell (and not give under temporary license) the rights. PAradox agreement condiction is a suicide for a little company and a big company never will stay at Paradox condictions. I don't know the FFG agreement, but the agreement who we receved from Paradox is too heavy for us, so we contracted the purchase, but nothing... For a company, it is better to invest in a totally new game, and not in two games "dead".
Now, Chronopia and WZ are alive, not strong, but alive. I love this two games (in special way Chronopia) and if we can, we'll would like support them in a "indirect" way. 

[Glenn M]

I have given up on a decent official release, Paradox are a bunch of morons.

[Topkick]

The key to the cost of the license rights is in my opinion the Mutant Chronicles movie. Paradox is expcting it to do well and are pricing the rights accordingly. They also jumped on the collectible minis craze by going with FFG. The license rights they quoted at that time were based on the impending release of both. Since then FFG has postponed release 3 times and I am betting they will miss their current projected release date. Also the movie has developed into something that has little to do with the game's storyline and had more than it's share of problems.

I am currently planning to NOT see the movie and have less than zero interest in the FFG game. If both of these projects tank as quickly and completely as I think they will, then perhaps Paradox will rethink their stance on the license rights and be more acceptable to selling the license or offering better lease terms.

I'm not telling everyone to boycott the movie and FFG game. You all have the right to do whatever you want but I have told you what I am planning to do and why. Something to think about maybe?

[Francesco]

Agree with Topkick, I wish all the best to FFG, they are a really nice company and I like theyr games, but I don't like CMG ( sinceraly, I hate this...).  For me the movie look like a bmovie, but I waint to see before hate this (in any case, it don't look like WZ movie, without Dark Eden, cybertronic, Nero and Valery Duval in Mishima army  ...). Indipentely by the movie, the Chronopia rights are not affordable (and, I don't know any project about Chronopia movie)
The Paradox problem, for me, is only one, they are not fans or gamer or collector of the games. Many chronopia or WZ fans hate excelsior, but, I think, excelsior doing very well for paradox, for a simple reason: they take alive the game, and the brand, in a difficult time, when many don't want buy/play or support two "dead" game. As my other post, this is only IMHO

[joshuaslater]

Excelsior was a tiny life support system for the IP's.  Paradox did not deliver anything promised on their end to help promote what was already the pariah of the gaming world, and Thom did not foresee the hurdles this bad history would entail for him either. 

Whatever happens with the license, the faithful here will be seeing some new ideas and playing more of Chronopia and Warzone. 

[Gubs]

Paraodox is looking for the same deal that they had with Excelsior.  They don't seem to realize that the IP's reputations are significantly worse post-EE than pre-EE. 

[joshuaslater]

The IP was buggered long ago.  It would be best if a company bought it outright like Brigade Models did with Celtos, lock, stock, and Orc falchion.

The IP couldn't have been further down the toilet than when Excelsior picked it up.  Distributors were bent over with leftover stock from Target and wouldn't even give Excelsior the time of day.  We were lucky we got a playable 2nd edition, and at least a couple years of collecting the armies.

[Gubs]

I'm not saying EE wasn't hamstrung.  Retailers are STILL dumping original Target stock.  How can you sell things for full price when everyone else has it for half off? You can't.  EE's success hinged on getting new products out that others weren't offering.  They didn't have a Chronopia release until two years into the license!  EE was in over its head from the start, but they sure didn't do much to help themselves.

[joshuaslater]

True that.  I'm not saying Excelsior didn't shoot themselves in the foot.  I am saying that the IP is damaged regardless.  It's brought down three companies now.  Not a good track record.  Target and Heartbreaker both had more to work with and still they went under.  EE had less and went under.  I don't know what Paradox has in mind, but I don't think anyone picking up the license will have much more success.  The market is changing from ten years ago to begin with. 

I do think a company owning the IP could stand a chance in today's climate, but no one should go near licensing.

[Gubs]

I don't think any company would be wise to touch the license.  They'd find themselves in a similar situation to EE.  I have no idea if Paradox would be willing to sell it.  For what they'd likely ask though, you could commission concept art, illustrations, and writing for your own entire world and not have to worry about the baggage that the current properties carry along.

[masherking]

The sad thing is I can care less about the game world. Let paradox sit on it as long as they want. The real lose is the Great game system EE hammered out. the Game rules itself was one of the best if not the best out there. And EE army list was top notch given what they had to work with.
      Would love to see the game system be put out there in some form.

[Topkick]

The sad thing is I can care less about the game world. Let paradox sit on it as long as they want. The real lose is the Great game system EE hammered out. the Game rules itself was one of the best if not the best out there. And EE army list was top notch given what they had to work with.
      Would love to see the game system be put out there in some form.

There is only one reply I can give and that is to quote Stan Lee - "Keep the faith True Believers"

[Veez]

Sounds like somebody knows something.

[Topkick]

Who? It's not me - I'm just this guy you know 

[joshuaslater]

To get back on Veez's topic:

I'd like to maintain our indie cred for a minute.  I'm working on some lists for figures, new and old, for Chronopia, running them by Thom so they can fit into what we've got already.  Our events, and army ideas should be the sections we develope the most around here, for both games, regardless of what happens.  It's our game, remember?